260 Raising Chicks and Hens

Show Transcript

GB 260 TRANSCRIPT Raising Backyard Chicks and Hens

Farmer Fred  0:00

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Welcome to the Garden Basics with Farmer Fred podcast. If you're just a beginning gardener or you want good gardening information, you've come to the right spot.

Farmer Fred

Easter egg season is here, and many of you may be thinking, why bother painting those eggs? After all, there are breeds of hens that lay beautifully colored eggs. So, Let’s just get some baby chicks, raise the hens, and gather the colorful eggs. Plus, we’ll save money on omelettes! Many feed and farm supply stores around the country now have those baby chicks in stock. Today, we back up a step or two and talk about what you should have on hand before you buy those baby chicks. We talk with an urban chicken consultant and certified poultry inspector about how to have a successful experience raising backyard chickens. You’ll learn about:

• What do you feed a baby chick? (9:00)

• Why you don’t want to use pine shavings or newspaper as the flooring for your baby chicks. (11:49)

• Why you should only offer warm water for those baby chicks to drink. (18:00)

• Precautions on using heat lamps around your chickens. (27:30)

• How to Pick a chick that isn’t a rooster. (31:29)

• What are the best breeds of chickens to have around small children? (34:29)

It’s all in today’s episode 260, raising backyard chicks and hens. We’re podcasting from Barking Dog Studios here in the beautiful Abutilon Jungle in Suburban Purgatory. It’s the Garden Basics with Farmer Fred podcast, brought to you today by Smart Pots and Dave Wilson Nursery. Let’s go!

RAISING BACKYARD CHICKS AND HENS, Pt. 1

Farmer Fred

Well, Easter is just around the corner. You might be thinking of adding maybe a chick or two to your family because really, I don't know why Easter is the time for that! Easter rabbits don't lay eggs. We all know that. But for some reason people want to get chicks, and that's fine. But do you know what to do with them? Probably the last thing you should do is buy a chick as the first step. First of all, what you should be doing is buying everything you need to raise chickens. And on that note, we are talking with a chicken expert, Cherie Sintes-Glover. She is an urban chicken consultant. Yes, that's a real thing. She runs the website, chickensforeggs.com. She is a poultry enthusiast, a certified poultry inspector for various fairs and shows, and she's raised a variety of chickens for fresh eggs for show, and of course, for the dinner table. And she specializes in helping new and future chicken owners. And can help you with your chicken coop options, chicken rearing, health issues, feeding, and a lot more. Cherie, always good to talk with you. Why do people buy chicks now?

Cherie Sintes Glover  3:12

I think they buy chicks now because there's a lot available. This is the best time, because they have such a variety to choose from. And it's kind of addicting, right? You go to the feed store and perhaps you're really planning on buying something else. And then you hear the little cheeps. So, you wander over to the brooder (the chick nursery) that the feed store has set up and you take a look and you go, “Gosh, they’re so cute!” And I think people just get captured by these cute little fuzzy, fluffy, things.

Then they start thinking about egg prices right now. And what they can do to maybe kind of help ease that. And besides, maybe this will be a fun project to have, because you’re thinking, “I’ve always wanted to keep chickens!” And next thing you know, they take home a little container, a little cardboard box, that has baby chicks in it. And as tempting as that is, I always ask people to kind of really take a step back and think about what you really need to do to get ready for these baby chicks. What do they need because, after all, you are their ‘mama hen’ right? For those first three months, people forget that chickens actually can live to be 10 years old. So it's definitely an investment. It's always good to get some education under your belt first, before you kind of take that big dive.

Farmer Fred  4:29

There is a very good article in The New York Times and don't we always all turn to the New York Times for advice on rural living? I don't know why they have it, but it's in their newsletter, “Wirecutter”, and they go through all the basics of raising chickens, how many you should have, the coops that they need, their health requirements, the varieties of chickens, and a lot more. So I would suggest that if you do get the New York Times, especially for your rural living advice, check out their Wirecutter newsletter article called, “The Best Chicken Coop and Accessories of 2023”. There’s a lot of interesting advice. Cherie, I know you read that very thorough article, and I know that you were impressed by their their sources of information, a few of which were from the UC Davis School of Veterinary Science.

Cherie Sintes Glover  5:15

I was really glad to see that, because there's a lot of misinformation online. It's funny to think back when I first started to keep chickens, 25 years ago. My grandparents had chickens. And I was raised with chickens. And so I always wanted some of my own. By the time my son was about three, I said, “We’re gonna get some chickens of our own.” And there was nothing out there for references. The internet wasn't there, right? There wasn't websites and Facebook and YouTube, right? Nobody knew about YouTube. Back then it didn't exist. And at the time, there was something called  the Poultry Information Exchange, PIE. It was the only thing you could find online. That was where I learned a lot of the basics about keeping chickens. Nowadays, you can find information on chickens all over the place. So, even the New York Times will talk about chickens. It's interesting, because to me, it doesn't feel as complicated to have chickens. But there are some basic things you want to be familiar with. And  what I loved about that Wirecutter article was, they actually involve some of the the avian scientists that are at UC Davis, which is great, because at the end of the day, you want to make educated decisions, right? Whether you're buying a new puppy, or whether you're keeping backyard chickens, you want to make educated decisions, and being able to recognize so much of that misinformation out there. Things might be frilly and pretty and look pretty shiny. It's really getting down to the nitty gritty of what the science is behind the things that we do with our chickens, especially when it comes to health issues and health concerns. I was just happy to see that the author of that article had reached out to UC Davis because we're so lucky here in the Central Valley to have them so close.

Farmer Fred  7:06

Way back when, before there was the internet, there was these things called books. I don't know if you kids remember that or not. But one reference that they recommend in this Wirecutter article is “The Storey’s Guide to Raising Chickens” by Gail Damerow, which sounds like a great title for a book, especially before you buy some young chicks. And I think in the past, you've mentioned this book.

Cherie Sintes Glover  7:31

I have. That is one of my all time favorite books about chicken raising, because the author, she actually has a series of different books for different livestock, she has a lot of good and reliable, accurate information about chicken keeping, which is fantastic. Definitely one to put on the book list. Another one, believe it or not, which is kind of surprising, The Chickens for Dummies book. It’s a great book, it's packed full of good information. And there's also a chicken health handbook, also by Gail Damerow. Then another one of my all time favorite books is called “City Chicks”. And that one talks about not only urban chicken keeping, but also urban gardening. So that's definitely one of my go-to books, especially if you live in an area of the United States that maybe hasn't really taken much enthusiasm to having backyard chickens. It's a great book to kind of derive information and statistics and details to help convince your city council that you can have backyard chickens, especially if you're in an urban environment.

Farmer Fred  8:41

So maybe before you buy that chick you check out Storey’s Guide to Raising Chickens, it's by Gail Damerow. Find out more and exactly what you need. And of course, this Wirecutter article from the New York Times, entitled “The best chicken coop and accessories for 2023”. Check that out, too. All right, let's get into the nitty gritty of this. I would still think that either you would be recommending that before people buy chicks, that they have some certain items back at the house.

Cherie Sintes Glover  9:11

Good question, Fred. Number One,  you want to realize that there are different stages of chickens, including chicken ages and sizes, right? So that means having a brooder that you can change over time as the chicks get big. What that might look like and what I've actually found to be maybe the best and easiest brooder, is actually those clear plastic bins that you can get from one of the big box stores. And you want the ones that are clear so you can see through it,  from across the room if needed. It's pretty simple. Basically you start with a smaller one and you graduate up to a larger one. Because if you already have chickens at home, for instance, and  you're bringing in maybe a new fresh supply of laying hens and their chicks, you're not going to be able to introduce those new chicks  to the existing flock until they are about the same size. Chickens are very relative, right? So size is important, they're gonna be more accepting of chickens that are about the same size they are, which is, which is kind of funny, but it's true.

With baby chicks, you're starting out with basic equipment. You're going to need a heat source, some kind of heat lamps, something to maintain that temperature, because for three day old chicks, they really do prefer temperatures around 95 degrees. And then gradually, it's going to decrease a couple of degrees each week after that. But it also depends on the weather, it depends on what our temperatures are. So you need a heat source. You're going to need some kind of brooder. I recommend the clear big plastic bins, and you're going to have maybe two or three different sizes, as you go along. And you're going to need to cover that. And I found that the easiest thing to do was to use a roll of window screen that you can get at the hardware store. And you can cut it to whatever size you need. Perhaps they have extra rolls in the back. And it works wonderfully because it not only allows for air and the heat to penetrate, you can have the heat lamp close to it without causing an issue, you can clamp the screen down.

And that screen cover on top, it has two purposes. One is to keep things out. So for instance, if you happen to have a cat at home, or something that might be very curious about those baby chicks, it helps to keep them out. But also it keeps the chicks in. And people are surprised at how often sometimes chicks can jump, how high they can jump, so that you basically get some clamps to clamp on the window screen to the bin, and you're all set. The other thing you're going to need is food and water as well as bedding.

For bedding, what I recommend for the first few weeks is actually using just a roll of paper towels. And sometimes people will try to use pine shavings, that kind of thing. But young chicks can get that confused with the feed. And you definitely don't want them filling up their digestive system with pine shavings. Paper towels work really great, they're absorbent, you can change them out pretty easily. And it also allows you to very clearly see what their droppings look like, which can be important when they're baby chicks. And so I just find that that's the easiest thing.

Another quick tip would be  puppy pads that you can get when you're training a puppy. Those can actually be pretty absorbent and be helpful  in the bottom of the brooder. So, you want a flat surface that is not slick. In the past, a lot of people would use newspaper. And what they found was newspaper was too slick, and it would actually cause leg injuries with the chicks. So stay away from newspaper. Stay away from pine shavings until they're a little bit older. And just go with something easy. The first few weeks, feed wise, you're going to want to get a Chick Starter feed. You have an option of medicated or non medicated. I've always gone with a medicated which basically helps prevent Coccidiosis, which is something that can affect baby chicks, especially around the four to six week age period. Medicated chick feed  usually has a higher protein level, which is good. Then water. Whenever you give water to your brand new baby chicks, you want it to be warm;  you don't want it to be hot water. But it should be warm, lukewarm, not cold. And you want to add something called electrolytes. And poultry electrolytes can be found at any feed store or any pet store these days. They're kind of like chicken Gatorade. So  you add that into the water pretty easily. That helps give them some extra nutrients when they're starting out so young. Then you just watch!

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RAISING BACKYARD CHICKS AND HENS, Pt. 2

Farmer Fred

Tell me about the watering device to allow these baby chicks to drink water without making a mess.

Cherie Sintes Glover  16:01

Oh, that is the the plight of the chicken keeper: how to get these baby chicks not to make a mess! Because they definitely can get messy with the water. You definitely want to go with a chick waterer if you can. And then the goal is to elevate it based on the height of the chick, which sounds tricky in itself, but they make actual special waterers that have a very narrow opening. And they usually come with a base and then maybe a quart sized plastic jar to hold the water. That container then screws into the base. And that the ones with chick bases are probably the best to use. And you can also get the chicks attracted to that water base and to drink water. An old timer trick was to take shiny pennies, some brand new shiny pennies, wash them off, and then actually place them into that rim of the chick water. The shininess basically attracts the chicks to come over and check it out. They peck at it, then they realize that it's water. You have to remember chickens aren't always the smartest. So that grabs their attention and come over to the water. But the best way to kind of minimize the mess is for the first week, you might start out with the chick water kind of just sitting there on the floor of your chick brooder. But each week, you're gonna raise it up a little bit. So I typically will use  a piece of a garden paver or a brick or something along those lines, you can use pretty much anything but you just want it to be stationary and sturdy, so that it holds up the water so it doesn't accidentally tip over. And you're elevating that which makes it so that when the chicks do start to scratch and you do start to add pine shavings, it gives you a way to kind of keep them from scratching those things into their water. But it is something you have to monitor. And you do have to  change the water on a frequent basis. And again, the most important part of that first week or two is to make sure it's warm water. Don't use cold water or just plain tap water. Warm water is important.

Farmer Fred  18:09

Did you say not to use tap water?

Cherie Sintes Glover  18:11

Oh, you can use  tap water. You want to make sure it's on the warmer side, not like room temperature or straight from the tap, because the water tends to be kind of cold from the tap. Go with something a little bit warmer but warmer  tap water is totally okay.

Farmer Fred  18:28

How often do you have to change that water, then, if it has to be warm?

Cherie Sintes Glover  18:32

Well, it should be warmer to start. It’s going to get down to room temperature, but initially it's going to be warm. So you just want to make sure it's on the warmer side when you give it to them. You just don't want it to be cold water. So if you have water in the fridge, you're not going to take that out and use that to fill up your chick water. It's just too cold on their system. So you're wanting something a little bit warmer. But you don't have to keep it warm. You don't want to stun their system with cold water. So always try to use warmer water. From the tap is fine. You don't have to get any special kind of  watering filtering system or anything like that. What's funny to me is, chicks grow and they become adult chickens. Those chickens, even though you could have  brand new, fresh water available to them, they'll always go after lthe muddiest little spot and try to drink water. So they're not too picky as they get older. But when they're chicks, you want to just make sure it's clean, that it has the electrolytes in it, at least for the first couple of weeks. That helps them get off to a good start.

Farmer Fred  19:30

If you're still wondering what a chick waterer looks like, we'll have a link in today's show notes leading you to where you can see what they look like. How many chicks should you buy originally?

Cherie Sintes Glover  19:44

It's funny, because people think, “okay, I'm just gonna get two or three.” But they always end up taking home more. I think because they are just so darn cute in the feed store. It kind of depends on how much space you have. And also what Your goal is. So if your goal is to have fresh eggs, and that's why you're buying the chickens, the recommendation is usually one chicken per per person in your household. Each chicken will lay about six eggs per week. So you can use that into your calculation. But I think four is a great number. If you're in an urban environment, most cities will allow you to have between  three and five chickens. So four is a great number because you have a couple of extras in there. That way you can bribe your neighbors with some fresh eggs along with having enough for your household, but it really just depends on how many eggs you go through. And keep in mind, too, that chickens naturally will go through a period during the year where they're not laying as frequently and  you can factor that into how many chickens and eggs you want per year. But four chicks is a good number.

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RAISING  BACKYARD CHICKS AND HENS, Pt. 3

Farmer Fred

Let's get back to our interview with Cherie Sintes Glover, urban chicken consultant, about how to raise chicks and hens.

Farmer Fred

Let's talk a little bit about where do you keep these chicks? Also, you mentioned a heat lamp. So I would think you would want to be able to monitor that heat lamp as closely as possible. So probably when you first bring them home, you would keep them inside the home. But at what point should they be moved outside into a coop?

Cherie Sintes Glover  22:47

When people first bring home those chicks and they have a brooder they're normally keeping them in like an extra bathroom. Maybe they have a mudroom, I've had them in my living room. The kitchen table, too, when you have baby chicks that are a couple of weeks old. iI’s not only  to have quick access to them, but you’re listening to them. Chicks are really good at letting people know, letting their “chicken mamas” know when something's wrong. Because a baby chick is typically pretty quiet. They might make little noises or scratching around, they're doing their thing during the day. But the moment they start to get loud, if they start chirping loud, that's a signal to you that something's wrong. Either the light has gone out, the heats turned off, they're too hot or too cold, something. Maybe their water got knocked over or something like that. So be able to access them quickly. And be able to hear them even if you're not able to see them is an important thing to do, especially in the first couple of weeks.

A lot of times people think, “well, gosh, can I just keep them in the garage”. But in the garage, the temperatures tend to have extremes. It's either really cold in the garage because of the cement floor, or maybe gets too hot. You have to be able to monitor that. And I think it's much easier to keep a consistent temperature for the chicks, even with a heat lamp, indoors where you are. It all depends on the space you have. And you can be creative on where you know where you can keep them as long as you can protect them and help maintain that temperature. So as the chicks get older, a couple things that come into play; number one, they're probably pooping a little bit more often. You're like, “Okay, how do I not have that smell?” And it doesn’t smell that bad. I've had other things that have smelled worse. You still  have to change the litter on a regular basis. You're still making sure they're in a clean environment and keeping up on that.

But you're gonna move them to that next level, right? Because what will happen within the next two months is, they'll start to feather out. So they'll look kind of gangly,  their feathers are coming in, all sorts of directions. They're not the prettiest things at that point. But you're waiting for them to become fully feathered. And once they become fully feathered, they actually won't need the heat at that point. Yes, they do need light, but they won't need the heat because they're able to maintain their body temperatures with their being fully feathered.

So at that point you have a couple of options. If it's not too cold and wet outside, then by all means you could have a temporary coop situation where you can move them outside, just as long as nothing can get to them, predator wise. Another option: if they've been in the bathroom or the mudroom at home,  now might be the time, when they're fully feathered, to move them to the garage. Again, it's all about space.

Adult chickens, standard size or your large fowls, will typically need about two feet by two feet square space per chicken. And if they're smaller, they won't need quite as much space. So the idea is to graduate up to the next cage or kennel or whatever it is. And I've seen people use everything from dog kennels with some wiring wrapped around. That  way, the chicks can't get out. Or big troughs. Even if you have a horse barn, you can wall off one of the stalls and you can use one of those. So it just kind of depends on what you have available.

And all of this is before they move into the big coop. So your big coop. You might be finishing your big coop because they got chicks before the chicken coop was actually finished. And so, when they're ready to move into that big coop, they're usually between four and five months old.

Farmer Fred  26:39

When do they start producing eggs?

Cherie Sintes Glover  26:41

Oh, it depends on the breed. different breeds of chickens will mature at different ages. So for instance, the Black Copper Maran tend to mature a little bit later. So they're usually closer to about seven or eight months old before they start laying eggs. Other breeds such as the Buff Orpington maybe the Barred Rock, maybe the Araucana or Ameraucana, even your Rhode Island Reds, tend to be a little bit earlier, they tend to be right around six months. You have some breeds that are a little bit earlier than that, some that are a little bit later. But right around six months is typically what you're looking for.

Farmer Fred  27:18

Let's go back and talk about the heat lamp. Because if there's one thing I hear more and more about, it's heat lamp fires. So this thing really needs to be looked at and kept under surveillance.

Cherie Sintes Glover  27:30

It's amazing to me how many fires you actually hear about. When you hear about barn fires and chicken coops going up in flames. It's devastating. Because not only are you losing your chickens in your chicken coop, but now you could have that fire move over to your home. And we've heard tons of stories where people's barns and houses will get burnt down and was all caused by a chicken heat lamp. When their baby chicks, yes, you need a heat lamp. It should be elevated above the brooder. And because you need to maintain that temperature around 95 degrees until they're fully feathered. But there's alternatives to those heat lamps. And you can buy these. They're basically platforms that emit a radiant type of heat. And you can buy those. So, there is no heat lamp required. And basically you put that in your brooder. The chicks will move under it when they need to warm up and move out when they warm enough. Those are a fantastic alternative. There's a couple of companies that make those. And so you can definitely invest in those if a heat lamp is not going to work out.

But where most commonly you see those barn fires caused by the chicken heat lamps is in the wintertime. And that's where they're actually not chicks, not situations where someone had baby chicks. These are adult chickens that someone has been concerned about, perhaps the adults getting too cold at night. And what I let people know is:  chickens are feathered creatures. They're just like the birds that you see in the trees in the winter. Just like there's birds out in nature, they're out there in the wintertime, they're in their nests. Chickens are the same way as those birds, the birds out in the natural environment. They don't need a heat lamp. And so neither do chickens. For your chickens, it depends on the climate you're in. So obviously if you're in Minnesota, you're probably going to have an insulated coop. But even those chickens in Minnesota are not going to need a heat lamp. And then for those of us that are here in the Central Valley, where we really don't have much of a winter. We have some days, maybe between five and 10 days worth of freezing temps. But your chickens are going to be just fine. And they really don't need a heat lamp. Instead, you make sure that they have a chicken roost which allows them to kind of condense  their bodies against their little toes or little chicken legs. And they stay warm and toasty. T the end of the day, they really don't need that heat lamp, if they're adults. If they're fully feathered, the adults won't need it.

BEYOND THE GARDEN BASICS NEWSLETTER - RAISING BEES

Farmer Fred  29:59

If the idea of raising backyard chickens appeals to you, you just might be mulling over the thought, “Well, why not raise backyard bees, too?”

It just so happens that today’s podcast guest, Cherie Sintes-Glover, besides being an urban chicken consultant, is also an apprentice Master Beekeeper. In today’s Beyond the Garden Basics newsletter podcast, she talks about how to get started raising bees. And we talk with one of the world’s foremost bee authorities, Dr. Norman Gary, on how you can become a successful honeybee hobbyist. That just so happens to also be the title of his book, too.

All that is in today’s Beyond the Garden Basics newsletter.

For current newsletter subscribers, look for the issue entitled, “Backyard Beekeeping Advice”. If you are already a subscriber, it’s probably in your email, waiting for you now.  Or, you can start a free subscription or read it online, it’s free! Find the link to the newsletter in today’s show notes or sign up at the newsletter link at our homepage, gardenbasics dot net.

RAISING BACKYARD CHICKS AND HENS, Pt. 4

Farmer Fred

Here on the Garden Basics with Farmer Fred Podcast today, we're talking with urban chicken consultant Cherie Sintes Glover. If you're going to be picking out chicks, you want hens. You really really don't want a rooster if you live in a city.

Farmer Fred  31:29

More and more citi